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Childlessness

Birth rates are dangerously low in all western countries because . . .

@TheEcho13 and @QauntumEpoch offer seemingly conflicting explanations for childlessness. But both seem to complain that socio-cultural values discourage people from having children. Perhaps it’s helpful to compare Anglo-Saxon countries (with values focussed on money and work and little or no parental leave) to Scandinavian ones (with values focussed on life-balance and family, and long parental leave for both parents). Unfortunately there seems to be no real difference in birth rates. Wealth also tends to correlate negatively with number of children. (Perhaps very rich families can be an exception, maybe because extreme wealth removes some remaining obstacles.) On the other hand, women in traditional families in the West do have more children. Finally, Scandinavian cultures score better on measures of happiness, while the happiness data for people embedded in traditional families is mixed. I’m not sure what this could mean for people who think childlessness is a societal problem that needs to be solved... (Personally I’m inclined to doubt that childlessness is necessarily a problem, at least for the coming 100 years or so.)

@QauntumEpoch replied to me that I am stupid. He probably meant that I was too stupid to understand that his reply was just ridicule of the OP and nothing more. For my comment it doesn’t matter much, I’ll leave it as it was.

Birth rates are dangerously low in all western countries because when women are told that all they are good for is having children, but that having children doesn’t make them important, they simply opt out. Women are told that they must reproduce to benefit society, but also that they’re ugly, useless and ready to be discarded by the time they reach 40. Women are told to take on the overwhelming majority of work in the home, to sacrifice the most to care for their family and let their husbands excel in their careers, but if their husbands don’t treat them well enough to keep them, then they are a burden to society and deserve nothing as a result. Women see all of these talking points every time they open social media or scroll a timeline. Even women who sought a more traditional dynamic are being turned off and reconsidering their desire when they see how men talk about them. Men asking for stay at home wives and mothers while also saying that her contribution and sacrifice is so minimal to the point of being worthless is abhorrent. Women know that having and raising children is going to be hard, that they will be living their lives in servitude, and majority of women are happy to do it, but not for men who tell them that it’s all they’re good for. Not for men who tell them that once they’re done having children they’re ‘used up’, that if the marriage doesn’t work out then everything belongs to him, and that doing all of it still doesn’t make them important. Despite pleas for women to start having children again, women don’t want to have children with men who don’t value them, so they’re not. In a world that doesn’t value mothers while telling women that that’s all they’re good for and reiterating that doing so still doesn’t make women important, women won’t become mothers. If you want to fix the birth rates, you start by treating motherhood with the value and respect is deserves.

Dito. Birth rates are dangerously low in all Western countries because when men are told that all they’re good for is working, sacrificing, and providing but that doing so doesn’t make them important they simply opt out. Men are told that they must break their backs to support a family, but also that their money and effort still aren’t enough that they’re emotionally unavailable, replaceable, and toxic. Men are told to take on the overwhelming burden of financial responsibility, to sacrifice their physical and mental health to give their family the best life, and to let their wives stay home and raise the children. But if the relationship breaks down, they’re treated like dangerous failures expected to give up their home, their kids, and half their income, while being shamed for not being more “present.” Men see these stories every time they open social media or talk to other divorced dads. Even men who wanted to be traditional husbands providers and protectors are now rethinking it after seeing how little that role is respected in the end. Women asking for men who will fund the household, take care of all the bills, and be strong masculine leaders while also saying that his role is oppressive, outdated, or not emotionally supportive enough is contradictory and disheartening. Men know that building and supporting a family will be hard that it means a life of pressure, stress, and service. And most men are willing to do it. But not for women who say he’s just a walking wallet. Not for women who tell him he’s disposable after he’s outlived his financial usefulness. Not for women who say that if the relationship ends, she deserves everything and he deserves nothing. Despite the pleas for men to “man up,” get married, and build families again—men are refusing to do it with women who don’t value them. So they’re not. In a world that demands everything from men money, protection, emotional labor, and loyalty but gives them little appreciation or respect in return, men are opting out of marriage and fatherhood. If we want to fix the birth rates, we start by treating fatherhood and male provision with the value and respect it deserves.

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